'08 Carvers

there is a carver down the dock which had to get one those windows replaced... took the guy well over a day to do that between removing all the sealant, etc...at close to $100 an hour these days (at least down here)... plus the glass that must have been a $2k incident.

the second boat isn't bad looking, or maybe it is because after the first one, anything woudl look good ! but again, they screw it up with the window on the rub rail below deck...

if you look at the interior pictures, you can see that they didn't even gain that much space by raising the sidedeck... the smaller settee doens't go against the hull anyway, so they're wasting the space behind it. same on the other side... marginal benefits and it puts the windows near and below the rub rail (whre you need fenders) plus you got to climb 6 steps to go from stern to bow.

And i simply don't get the point of a 40/50 footer where you have no room at the bow. whenever we have friends on board, between a huge flybridge, a big aft deck and teh bow, all our friends end up at the bow. Great, view, nice breeze, plenty of sun... this boat (#2) has a smallish sunpad and no seating... and very little room to stand to work the anchor...

and note how far forward the bow rail is from the deck ? you cant' even hold on it ! do these stylists ever use their boats ?

81359_p_t_90x60_image01.jpg


look at the foredeck on the 38... an adult can't even lay down and picture yourself standing at the bow working the anchor... the railing is barely reachable to hold on. nice touch.

and dont' get me started on the 90 gallons water tank :-) if you want to call a boat a yacht, give it enough water so guest don't have to take navy showers, use paper plates and post yeollow mellow rules
 
Obviously PascalG, you have not BEEN on one of these Carvers or you'd know that the interiors are huge for the boat's size. The windows out to the sides adds alot of interior space...please don't speak and quote pictures while not ever being on something. Also remember that not everyone wants a 37 year old 53 foot barge regardless of whether it is a hatteras or Viking or....anything. And what is with you and water capacity?
 
well, i'm glad you disclosed that you sell these boats... explains the allegiance.

of course the interior are bigger than average... but not that much bigger. for ex. take a look at maxum 41 and 46 (1998-2002 before they were merged into meridian...) they have almost as much room as these boats... look at the set up of the saloon, in the 42 they gained very little room with the raised side deck because the settee isn't agaisnt the hull anyway.

thanks for the advice, I know not everyone is interested or need an old barge... there are other boats out there that are equally as roomy yet easier to use. the MAxums i mentioned, even the current Sea Ray or Silverton convertible. interior room is not the absolute priority on a boat, unless it never leaves the dock...

when you spend... a few hundred thousands on something the builder calls a yacht, do you want to go camping ? I don't... most women don't either... especially the women ! it's just one example of how builders cut corners on boats... sorry... yachts.

look at the foredeck on that 38, can you really tell me that you can safely stand at the bow while raising anchor with the bow rail extending beyond the bow ?

are you selling boats or house boats ?
 
Pascal - I've got a '99 350 Mariner - I'm betting that you've never been in one....it has AMAZING amounts of ROOM...puts alot of larger boats to shame for interior volume, flybridge space, etc....BTW - I've got plenty of room on the bow for anchor duties and such (don't you have a remote for the windlass??)...guess you need to get on one and see for yourself...the bow rails on mine are perfect...strong as well (ask me how I know)...most of the time we spend on the bridge, cockpit, water or salon....my wife loves to sit on the bow and chill....we've had 6+ on the bow with no issues....btw - it has a bow love seat that folds down and also has a nice sun pad.
 
yeah... and you've never had a windlass jam, or never cleat your rode or never rinse your rode ? plenty of cases where you need to stand at the bow...

I'm not sayign the railing isnt strong, it looks very good, it's tall,has add'l rails between the deck and top rail and seems well designed except for the overhang... if you look at the pic above, i'm sure you'll notice the railing extends much further than on earlier boats, compare the to yours...

i know the mariner is a breakthrough design in term of space, no doubt about that and that it has a seat at the bow. my comment about the lack of bow space was about the 38 pictures above, not enough room for one adult to lay down.

again, if you look carefully you'll see that moving the deck higher on the 38, 42, etc... doens't really yield significantly more space inside compared to other boats in that size. gaining a few inches isn't worth putting the windows near the rub rail and having to climb up from the cockpit to get to the bow...
 
the 38 has practically no bow at all. I looked at it a good bit before buying our silverton. What the 38 carver does have though is a huge cockpit...probably the biggest in that size class. The bow is gone b/c they wanted a large cockpit and large saloon so they pushed it all forward. The bow is so small though you can't really have more than 2-3 people on it but you can fit a whole pack of people in the cockpit. My cockpit on the silverton is probably 1/2 the size but i've got a relatively large bow area and one of the larger saloons in it's class. So like always...seems to be a comprimise. I look at the carver's 38 cockpit and think how nice it would be to fit that many people for entertaining. But their bow is basically not there and their bridge seating is very small. I can fit probably 3x's the number of people on my bridge than the carver 38 sedan can.
So do you want a bow, a cockpit, a saloon, or a combo of maybe the 2 but getting all 3 ain't really happening til you get over 50' it seems.
 
Pascal makes some practical points. For me I'm a fan of carvers ( own a 36 mariner ) Mine has a huge bow but is an 85. Though I wish it had a seat up front.. It just has the pad.. Hmm maybe a little glass work is in order.
Anyway, I have to say I like the wide body rail on top approach. Mt other favorite boat is a 38 chris catalina.
But.. The walkways are just so tiny.. I'd rather have the on top and use the space in the salon
 
Pascal wrote: "yeah... and you've never had a windlass jam, or never cleat your rode or never rinse your rode ? plenty of cases where you need to stand at the bow..."

Like I said, plenty of room on the bow of my 350 (standing/sitting/line duty, etc)...that's where the four 12" dia. fender baskets are...as well as the bow lines...and also foot controls for the windlass....and water/waste fittings...lots of room...and I'm NOT a small guy...not knocking you Pascal - but you must be much much larger than me!!!! lol Is that why you have the Hatt?? Just giving you grief!
 
Pascal and others, you can say what you want about those side windows but they are a major break through (no pun intended) :). I looked at several 350s but ended up with a Silverton 330 SB which is a little smaller than the Carver 350 (something I needed to comply with 35' LOA). I loved the interior of the Carver. It is big, real big for a boat that has 36' LOA (IIRC). A few people make cracks about how my boat looks like a sneaker and I actually agree. However, I always have the last laugh when they see the space inside the Salon.

True, if I was hit just right, the windows would be a big deal but hey, I can live with that trade-off, it's a big "IF". Besides tons of light inside, what I do have is not one but two rub-rails so that when I'm against a piling, all is good. I just have to make sure to be careful not to rub against a half-size piling in chop where the boat may rock and the piling may hit the window as the window may break. This, I can live with!

Pascal, have you ever been on the 350? With it's full size refridge, seating for I'd guess six at the dinette and sleeping for six. It has two entrances to the head which has a real full-size shower stall....good enough for two or three if you're kinky. Also, bow access is EXTREMELY safe with the side-walk design and high rail with cable support inbetween. I let my kids fish up there un-supervised (with PFDs of course). The rails are a major safety point for me. If my kids were smaller, I'd install netting but they're safe at 8 years old.

These boats are huge for their size.
 
I am picking up a 2005 33 SS this Saturday. I originally was going to get an 08 Bayliner becuase it was extreemly well eqipped but was a little too small, especially the bridge.

I like the Carver or I would not have bought it. It is well eqipped and very spacious in the salon for its size. Its edge to edge 13' 1" salon is really nice. I do find the anchor bow too far forward and a little scary to lean over. I don't find the bow rail all that stiff and stout but am covinced it will not give way. I find the bow area to be OK.

But what do I know?
 
Guys

We all need to bow down to the 40 year old boats. While we're at it, let's all go back to rotary dial telephones, 2 stroke smelly diesels, polyecter clothes, ect. let's quit ragging on the newer style boats.

Wheras I would not have some of the new styles, lots of folks like them as they are selling.
 
Jay... i'm not talking style here, to each his own, as walter said, the mariner styling is a little different... i'm talking about being user friendly and how far builders and buyers are willing to sacrifice safety and practicality to gain a couple of cubic feet inside.

as i've said earlier, there is no doubt that the mariner is a break through design as far as sapce is concerned, the forward access from the bridge is actually fairly practical.

What I'm saying is that you don't gain a lot more space by raising the sidedeck and putting big windows under the sidedeck. you could still have large windows if the sidedeck was lower. these designs trade very little extra space (look at the cabin layout of the 38) for exposed windows and steps to go to the bow.

Jay, I'm not advocating old boats in this thread, just that boats should be boats. there are many new models out there which do not compromise "boatability" and still very spacious... the Silverton convertible, most expresses, Riviera sedans, even the Searays sedans if they could just design a decent ER... many meridians, etc... the list go on.
 
Ah yes, the engines. Here's a partial shot of my engine room in the 330 Sport Bridge. Pretty impressive if you ask me...at least I was impressed for a 33' boat.

HPIM2676.JPG
 
yep... absolutely.... although it should be considered normal, not impressive, if other builders even cared about ER serviceability.
 
"We all need to bow down to the 40 year old boats. While we're at it, let's all go back to rotary dial telephones, 2 stroke smelly diesels, polyecter clothes, ect. let's quit ragging on the newer style boats."

If rotary dial telephones worked better, then YES, I'd say lets go back to them. Modern boat styling and design has gone into the toilet, IMHO. The boats today are less seaworthy, less ergonomically designed, less functional as boats than at any time since the first pleasure boats came along about 100 years ago. They make great floating condos, though, and tickle the eyes of rich people at boat shows, most of whom don't know a damn thing about piloting a boat, so that they aren't going to ask the salesman how you dock it until long after their loan coupon books arrive...

I've had my qualms with quite a few current Carver models in this regard, but since this is the Carver forum and we might offend somebody, lets pick on Sea Ray. Today my friend (an avid SR buff) and I saw one of those new "spoonbill" style Sundancers that they sell nowadays, and we were shocked at just how pronounced the drop in freeboard is at the bow. Oh, sure, it makes visibility better from the helm, but now that boat is a helluva lot more susceptible to breaking waves over the bow. Not to mention the undulating sidedecks and those silly large breakable windows set very low in the hull sides that replace portholes nowadays. So it is LESS seaworthy than the model that came before it.

Now take a boat like Pascal has - THERE's a vessel that is both able to tackle heavy seas AND has excellent visibility, it won't sink if a porthole gets busted and you can walk down the sidedecks without killing yourself. So the boatbuilders out there used to know how to do it, but have forgotten in favor of designing in the sizzle needed to sell these things to millionaires at boat shows, IMHO...
 
Rotary dial phone still work when the power fails. Try that with your remote or celluar phone. Many new things are an improvment but just because it is new doesent make it better. The Edsel was new once too and wierd boat styles will likly follow it. Fads come and go but classic form follows function designs always survive.
 
Pete... or even a boat like the Meridian 490 ... based on the old Bayliner pilothouse. far more seaworthy than those low bow / reverse sheer boats.
 
Funny you should mention telephone. We were at my SIL's yesterday, the phone rang and my BIL was complaining how he can never find the cordless since she won't put it back on the holder and when he does find it, it's dead. I responded, I've solved that problem. After three different cordless systems, I went to e-bay and bought a 1984 AT&T wall phone and a 25' cord that reaches all around the kitchen. Kinda what our moms had. No problems since then!! So, there ya go Pascal, I DO appreciate older technology when it's better..LOL :)
 
LOL - I have had the same thing in my kitchen and downstairs office for years! Nothing like a 25' cord and a nice clear sound of the person on the other end...

Ever hook a microphone to a phone line? You can, you know. When I was in radio awhile back a 12 year old kid showed me how to to hook one of my Shure 57s to a 3 wire incoming analog phone line. That way, I could put a headset on and listen to the announcer on the radio, and talk back to him clear as a bell. Its how the meteorologist on your local radio station's morning show sounds like he's sitting next to the DJ, because usually he's in an office somewhere miles and miles away...
 
quote:
Originally posted by WALSHIE

Ah yes, the engines. Here's a partial shot of my engine room in the 330 Sport Bridge. Pretty impressive if you ask me...at least I was impressed for a 33' boat.

HPIM2676.JPG


Click to expand...


Chris,
Thats sweet, nice room
 
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