Docking with wind off the dock

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lark

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Anyone have some pointers for me. I have 35' express cruiser with twin I/O's. I've had a heck of a time getting the boat docked with a medium strong wind off the dock.

Both times I was single handed and no one was on dock to help. Also no bow thruster. Usually in this situation I come straight at the dock, when the bow is near, I then pivot to port using the engines, sliding into the stern into dock. This gives me enough time to exit the boat and tie a line mid-ship.

This time there wasn't enough room make that approach. I tried backing in and could easily get the stern to the dock. But the bow was swinging wildly away from the dock and the boat at the next dock was close. I could tie the stern off, but then what? Is it possible to pivot the bow around when tied from the stern?

I hate docking where success depends on me running from the helm before the wind blows me off the dock. There has to be a better way.
 
if you have a bimini or other type of canvas, drop it before docking. it will help reduce your wind profile. with twin drives, you should be able to pivot the boat, even in moderate wind. the trick is knowing the pivot point and that takes a little practice. other options would be to use your radio and call for assistance docking. most marina's are happy to oblige and will send someone to the dock. securing the middle of the boat to the dock (called a spring line) will help control the entire boat. i've seen some people leave dock lines connected to the dock and hanging from a pole so the line can easily be grabbed by the captain and tied to a mid-cleat.
 
When you find out, let me know. :)

I have tried going into the wind -- sometimes successful. Many times a total crash and burn because I tend to get pinched.

The best I have found is to start upwind of the dock, and slowly but surely go forward, letting the wind blow me into position. I run right up along the side of the dock. If it doesn't look like you'll hit it, then you are too far away. Then hop off and tie up quick. It is certainly always an adventure. Good luck.
 
"securing the middle of the boat to the dock (called a spring line) will help control the entire boat."

Technically it's a breast line. And that does work well. Tie that line snug to the dock and neither the bow nor the stern can move to far out from the dock.

"Is it possible to pivot the bow around when tied from the stern?"

Yes. But if you can have a line rigged up from say the breast cleat on your boat that you can tie to a cleat on the dock about midway between your stern and your breast cleat. In other words a spring line running aft from your mid point to a cleat on the dock. You can come tight on that with the inboard eng in forward at idle with the wheel turned a bit away from the dock and that will pull and pin the boat to the dock. It should hold it right up against the dock to where you have plenty of time to get the other lines on.
 
a breast line is hard to use in when the wind is blowing off the dock since by the time you secure it the boat has already been pushed off and is now too far...

using a spring line, as Bill described, is the best way and is almost a one size fits all solution. the trick with an express is to secure it without getting off the boat (bad idea to step off the boat until it is secured...). usually by the time you bring the boat close enough, leave the helm and get to where your cleat is on deck, the boat has been pushed too far to secure the line. If you are still close enough, again dont' get off the boat. throw the bight (middle section) of the line on the dock behind the cleat, pull on the bitter end to catch the cleat, cleat it back on the boat, then go back to the helm and spring on the line.

plan B, which works with express because of their size/limited windage is to prepare your lines (bow, spring and stern) and bring all bitter ends to the cockpit. then as soon as the boat is alongside, step off holding the lines and secure them. Not very elegant but it will work. bad idea with a larger/high windage boat!

with wind off the dock, I find that using momentum (resonably...) helps. if you come close and pivot the stern to the dock, usually the bow will move away from the dock, but with a little momentum you will get the boat in the right position.

in theory, you could tie the stern first, then use that as spring to bring the bow in (dockside engine in reverse and offside in forward) but that's not as efficient as a standard spring line.
 
My boat acts like a big sail in some conditions. I have found that using the props to pull me upwind in reverse; like a front wheel drive car in the snow, works very well. I'll back to the dock, up wind, secure a stern line then swing the boat into the dock by going forward, this brings her into the dock. I've had white caps breaking on the dock and this still works.
 
Presumably you have lines cleated to the boat and laid out for easy deployment. With a good constant breeze pushing you off, limited space and no help it sounds like a worst case scenario. I'm thinking if you cannot get the breast line looped around a dock cleat and made fast on the boat sitting at the helm, on the first try, it's probably going to be as bad or worse than backing the stbd stern in, locking it down and then bringing the bow around with the props. With a spring line you still wind up losing the bow or stern to the wind while working at the opposite end. Once the stern is in and locked down perhaps you have a better shot at the breast line from the helm.
Of course this is all speculation and variable based on how the cleats of your boat line up with those on the dock, the size of the lines and how well they fit onto the cleats. I think a 35 is too large to hop off without at least one line secure unless you have backed into a slip and have fenders all around to keep you off the dock and your neighbor.
 
With I/Os you have decent control of thrust. When space is limited and an off the dock wind getting a line secure is the most important thing. after that use the directional thrust to swing the boat however you want. Avoid using throttle just be patient. Getting off the boat before it is tied with at least one like is a bad idea IMO. people have been known to trip or otherwise fail to make a solid landing, doing so while trying to hold the boat is not something I would recommend.
 
Instead of breast or normal spring line, if you have room aft you might try running the spring very loosely from mid-cleat to stern cleat before your approach, keeping the slack safely in the cockpit. When at closest approach to the dock, slip any part of that line over the appropriate dock cleat or piling , then put the engines in slow reverse to snug to the dock. Works as a spring with possibility of securing to the dock from the cockpit in some circumstances, and somewhat better limits vessel travel aft in tighter spots.
 
Thanks everyone for the advice so far. This situation is a public docks on our lake which are first come first served and totally unmanned, so skilled help is not really available. What I usually do is wait for a dock on the the side so the wind pushes me in. But these docks tend to be crowded so waiting is not always an option.

I am able to get the stern to a post and could get it tied. So if I had a spring from the mid-ship cleat ready instead of the line from the aft cleat, I could come forward on the spring and pull the boat in? This would be better than trying to pivot on the short stern line.

Pascal your Plan B was my method on smaller boats. But in this case I don't have the bow on the dock when the stern is, so it would need to be a long line.

As you also say, if I can get momentum towards the dock, get the bow in and then pivot, I can reliably land the boat. In these cases I could not get momentum due to the neighboring docks.
 
quote:
Originally posted by lark

I am able to get the stern to a post and could get it tied. So if I had a spring from the mid-ship cleat ready instead of the line from the aft cleat, I could come forward on the spring and pull the boat in?
Click to expand...


I like this up to the point the wind shifts and pushes you aft and the line binds up on the pole and and and.... If space is tight I am wondering about getting the line short enough to allow you to use the thrust you might need. But a spring line will provide more leverage for the boat to swing on at the cost of bringing the aft end out since it is not secure. But if you get a spring and the aft line on, I think it's all better.
 
First, thanks for putting up a BOATING thread!!

A stern spring line should work fine. Affix the aft line to a post, make it relatively short, put the outside engine in forward and the bow will come around. Or, perhaps you can use a boat pole to grab something after putting the stern line on?

I had a slip with about 2' or less between me and my neighbor. The wind seemed to ALWAYS blow me his way. I would put fenders on both sides and if the wind blew me his way before I was totally secured....so be it. I spoke to him ahead of time and he did not care as he would do the same against my boat.
 
What it does is give you the option of using it as a spring or a breast line once you have two on the dock. If you leave the stern line loose and the spring tight it might also be easier to bring the bow in using the leverage of the spring.

It gives you options in a difficult environment. Would you rather have one or two lines on the dock?
 
all else being equal, always select the largest breast line. i'm just saying.......
 
Are you backing into a slip or pulling parallel to the dock?

Have you considered a "landing loop"? They look pretty effective. I have no experience with them though.
 
Got it Boatbum, Thanks.

Well you can't argue with Bruce, nothing beats a large breast line.

KiDa, in this situation I'm pulling parallel to the dock. But there is another dock next to it, so a shallow angled approach is needed. The landing loop might not work, no cleats on these docks, boats tie to 4"x6" posts or 12" pilings.
 
You may find going forward on a mid-cleat spring , even with the wheel turned away from the dock , is more likely to bend the curve of the boat to the dock , leaving the boat angled in at the bow. On the other hand , backing with a mid-cleat spring is more likely to snug the straighter aft section of the boat in nicely parallel to the dock.

However, if you have & employ a "spring cleat" somewhat aft of mid-ship and go forward , there can be enough straight hull section forward of the cleat to keep the boat from angling in.

Whenever possible plan & set up ahead , so the boat lines can be adequately handled right from the cockpit until all is securely under control. Of course if this was your own permanant slip you'd have the perfect length lines on the dock and/or spiles and only use a boat spring if really necessary. If you do really need to leave the boat to tie up, it can be a saving factor to have a LARGE loop on the dock end of the boat lines , so if a line gets away from you you can just slip another right over the nearest piling or cleat for at least one definite point of attachment right away, and that beats swimming or waving to your boat. Then you can just imagine you are hand-lining tuna as I used to do. :D
 
Like Capt Bill & Pascal say. A springline is your best friend. You don't even have to tie it at the dock cleat. Don't need to leave the boat. That is a bad idea anyway. Tie one end on the boat spring cleat, loop the spring over the dockcleat, tie off back to the boat springcleat (this is where having decent sized cleats are important), now you can go fore or aft on the springline & the boat docks itself. Leave it in gear till you get another line on the dock, same looping method so you don't have to leave the boat. Take out of gear once secured with at least one line. Do all the adjustments at leasure.
 
Single handing can be hard. For an express or similar layout, try BACKING in at an angle, get a stern line on, then go ahead with the offshore engine, and the boat will swing right in. More wind might take a bit more power, but it WILL swing in.

I have a houseboat and I use a bow line the same way.. I nose in, get a bow line on the dock and back down on it. It works either way; you work whichever end of the boat is easiest for you.
 
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