electric heads?

Veg

Veg

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It looks like our next boat will have an electric head, that's just how it works, every boat we like seems to have this instead of our preferred vacuflush. Jabsco heads that either came in electric (or in some cases were converted to electric). It looks like they all are raw water flushing...

I'M GOING TO MISS MY VACUFLUSH!

In any case... I sort of don't like the idea of a raw water flushing head... I've heard stories of bad odors etc that I never had with the freshwater flushing vacuflush...

My questions are:

1- are most electric heads set up for raw water flushing?
2- are raw water flushing heads convertible to fresh water flushing? Too hard or too expensive?
3- what if I wanted to replace the head system with a newer system? what would be the best kind of system to look at, considering everything including cost?

Is raw water flushing just not a big deal at all?

What are the important things here? I could see ourselves putting some money into the waste system right away to make sure that it's reliable.

A friend suggests I upgrade the head to a Raritan Atlantes, "it can handle anything"...

But frankly what I need is some education in the world of electric heads. Keep in mind we're looking for a boat to be used for a few years in freshwater and then move with us to saltwater.
 
I have only had raw water heads , used in salt water. Yes you can get an odor when left standing for a few days but a couple flush's and it passes, but can smell nasty until that happens.

I have had Jabsco and currently have Raritan crowns. Both have worked good for us.
When we bought our current boat (has two heads) one was giving us some trouble so I bought two refurbished base units through Raritan, once you send your unit back to them you get a 200.00 rebate. I think we paid 400 total after rebate (apiece).
On my intake thru hull I have a small screen filter that is intended to capture foriegn crud before it gets to the impeller or bowl, it seems to work well and I usually clean it a few times a year.
I would rather have the vacuflush system for quietness but it was just not on the boat we fell for and we have had other prioritys when it came to upgrades. All and all I can't complain.
 
Good to know. Thanks for the feedback.
 
Ernesto, I converted last year from a Raw water flush Jabsco to a VacuFlush systm, I am never going back! If your going to spend the money to upgrade go all the way. I picked up my system on E-Bay brand new about $1,000.00. It even came with a 12 gallon holding tank which I upgraded to a 45 gallon. Now I love the long periods between pump outs and the low current the VacuFlush uses compared to the Jabsco and the fresh water lack of stink! I'll never go backwards when it comes to marine heads. Regards Bill
 
Ernesto,

We had the Jabsco raw water flush in our last boat--and then again in our big boat. After we bought it, I had it converted to the Jabsco quiet flush (which is freswater). The main issue most talk about the the raw water flush is how noisy they are. As you may know, that noise is coming from the raw water impeller. The actual macerator/empty part is not noisy at all.

We love the upgrade and the new head works perfectly. The head was less than $500. To snap my fingers, money is no object, I would like a vacuflsuh. But to have the exact same footprint, a good performing head, and an easy install, the Jabsco was an easy choice for me. My second choice would have been the well regarded Sea Era.

From a price-performance standpoint, I would go with the Sea Era or Jabsco quiet flush heads. I would skip the fresh water conversion to an existing raw water head.

I just asked these same questions, and several others have too, so check some other threads for good info there too. I didn't bother with a search, I just started from the last page and scanned every thread. I wanted the crash course in heads!

Good luck!

Paul
 
Interesting Paul... So what does it entail to install a Jabsco quiet flush - freshwater - head where an old Jabsco raw water head used to be installed?
 
quote:
Originally posted by Ernesto

Interesting Paul... So what does it entail to install a Jabsco quiet flush - freshwater - head where an old Jabsco raw water head used to be installed?

Click to expand...
I had the install done at my boatyard while the boat hauled for the new starboard engine. They used a t fitting from the freshwater supply for the sink. I had them install the new rocker switches where the old one was. You can choose to straight flush, empty only, or fill only (nicer for #2).

Other than that, everything else was an easy connection to the existing hoses.

Paul
 
i'd hate to go from Vacuflush to raw water electric!! beside the smell after water sat, you also have one or more extra underwater holes to worry about, sea cocks, hoses, etc...

my next choice after, or maybe even equal to FV, woudl be the atlantes. I know a couple of guys who converted and are very happy.
 
I installed a Raritan Crown head in my current boat. I was a little dissapointed until I converted it to a fresh water flush. Vic has the whole conversion process in the sanitation forum. Now it works fantastic....much quieter and flushes faster. It will take on the largest of loads with no problem. (trust me!) I installed a wet/dry switch so I could choose that option also. I've helped a few people take apart their vac-u-flushes to repair a leak or clog and that is no picnic.

Jim
 
>

To answer your questions, as I know them:

1) Prior to around 2002, most electric heads were designed to be used with raw water only. These days however, you have the option. You have to order your new head in the configuration you want - raw water flushing, or pressurized fresh water flushing. The term "fresh water flushing" in the marine sanitation industry means pressurized fresh water from your boat's onboard pressure system. It doesn't mean lake or river water. Lake or river water falls under the same category as salt water flushing - they flush with RAW water (from outside the boat). Most electric toilets these days can be ordered for raw water flushing or for fresh water flushing - one or the other, but not both. Ignore any references in West Marine's any distributor's catalog that say the toilet will work on either one. Their wording is WRONG - the toilet is designed and built for one application or the other, not both.

2) Raw water toilets are not easily converted to fresh water-flushing toilets. It CAN be done in most cases, but the parts required run in the neighborhood of $200-$225 to do it, and there's a fair amount of work involved.

3) The Jabsco Quiet Flush and the Raritan SeaEra, built for fresh water flushing (on the Raritan SeaEra, be sure the letter "F" is in the model number, example: 160MF912. If the letter "F" isn't in the model number, but there is an "I" or an "R" in its place [5th position in], it is a raw water-flushing unit.) are both good toilets - however, being employed by Raritan, I'm partial to the Raritan SeaEra. The pricing for either of them is fairly close as well; in fact, the SeaEra is usually a little cheaper.

To many, raw water flushing is no big deal at all. To others, it is. The nasty green, dank marina water laying in the bottom of the toilet bowl all week long, can impart an odor inside the boat. In addition, if there isn't a fine mesh strainer in the incoming supply line, anything from eel grass, to minnows, to whatever, can be drawn into the the toilet along with the incoming rinse water. They can lodge themselves inside the hollow rim at the top of the toilet bowl, being too big to fit through the drain holes at the bottom of the rim. Inside there, they decay. Then, when you flush the head the first time after coming aboard on a Friday night, the smell is enough to run you off the boat! It gradually lessens as the toilet is used, and 'round about Sunday night, it's usually gone... So whether or not flushing your head with raw water is a big deal, mainly depends on the condition of the water at your slip or mooring.
 
Would it make sense to add a dash of oderloss to your raw water head before you leave the boat sit for any period over 24 hours?. Just a capfull in the bowl (not flushed) to help prevent these odors?..Or would I be wasting my money
 
Ernesto,
I had a vacuflush on my searay, first head that I did not have to pump to flush. I really liked it and thought I would never have a different head. When I bought my 2004 Silverton, the upgrade to a vacuflush was way to much money, as a matter of fact, I could have scrapped my head and had a vacuflush put in afterwards for the same cost of the upgrade. So with that knowledge I said, WTF, if I don't like it I will just replace it. Well 5 seasons later the "Par Quiet" works just as well as the vacuflush.

The only advantage I see to the vacuflush is it uses less water per flush, therefore less time at the dock pumping out. I don't remember the numbers on the difference but it was substantial.

Walter
 
TIC, putting a little Odorlos in the toilet bowl certainly won't hurt, but it won't have any effect on whatever may be trapped inside the rim of the toilet bowl. So try it, if it helps - good! If it doesn't, a few capsful of Odorlos wasted won't put you in the poorhouse, and you can always discontinue using it.
 
Mr "Head Master", thanks for the detailed reply. As for your answer to question #3...

Why a Raritan SeaEra but not the Atlantes? Just space concerns? I'd be tempted to go to the latter (if I can make it fit) if it's indeed a better system.

I just notice the boat listing says 20 gallons holding tank... Man a Vacuflush would seem more appropriate. I wonder how many electric toilet flushes it'd take to fill such a small tank up!!!!
 
Our boat has a 40 gallon holding tank and an Atlantes head. There are 4 buttons on our Atlantes: Normal flush (10 sec flush), water saver (5 sec flush), momententary flush (flush as long as the button is press), and empty bowl. The first time we had 5 people aboard for a week, we used the Normal flush almost exclusively. We had to find a pump-out daily. On our most recent cruise with the same 5 people, we are able to go 2 - 3 days between pump-outs. You learn to use the appropriate button.

To me the perfect set-up would be to have a head that works just like home (guess I should add that I bought pressure assisted toilets at home so I don't have to deal with clogged watersaver toilets). I hate having to "manage" the holding tank (I have looked at getting a larger holding tank, but access for installation is challenging). I hate having to discuss head useage with guests.

To me, the Atlantes is a great head. Knowing what I know now, I would buy a differently configured model than I currently have. I have a raw water, remote panel, self-contained unit (all the pumps are insde the head). If I were to buy a head today, I would buy an Altantes with fresh water, remote panel, remote pumps). The fresh water to reduce order. The remote pumps to reduce noise of a flush.

Mark
 
I just installed a wilcox newport with the foot pedal. I am very pleased with the operation so far.You can control the amount of water you put in by lifting the pedal,press down to flush. It is quieter than the electric jabsco conversion I had by a good bit,but still a little loud. One down side is it draws alot of power, but you only use it for a short period so it should not be too bad. This toilet has a huge discharge and flushes with much more force than the jabsco. Seemed like a good deal for around $400 time will tell.
 
Ernesto, the Atlantes "Freedom" is definitely better than either one of the other two I listed, but the issue of cost was mentioned. Of the Raritan heads (in my opinion), the SeaEra gives the best value for the dollar. The Atlantes "Freedom" costs roughly twice as much as the SeaEra - plus it has a much larger footprint. But yes, if you want the best, and have the room for it, I'd certainly have no qualms in recommending the Atlantes "Freedom."
 
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