Lectrasan illegal?
- Thread starter bkap
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Bill,
I think that the Peconics and the GSB have been designated as no discharge. Perhaps that is what he means.
I think that the Peconics and the GSB have been designated as no discharge. Perhaps that is what he means.
Not that I am aware of as long as you can lock the unit and discharge valve when in an NDZ I have not seen anything of the sort. I am sure Vic from Raritan will chime in quickly. I just had my boat surveyed after I added a Hold-N-Treat controlling a PuraSan the PuraSan pulls from the holding tank and can be locked out with a key. My survey was 2 weeks ago and I have the PuraSan USCG Type 1 approval sticker and documentation. PuraSan and LectraSan operate differently but they do two things make the discharge particulates small enough for approval and snitize the discharge to EPA standards.
Bill
Bill
Your surveyor is either mistaken or maybe he way trying to say your region is a NDZ. Lectra/San, Electro scan, and Purasan are three Type I waste treatment systems made by Raritan. They are not legal for use in Federal No Discharge Zones (NDZs). NDZs include lakes and all other closed bodies of water and other specific zones. Here is the list of all NDZs by state.
http://www.epa.gov/owow/oceans/regulatory/vessel_sewage/vsdnozone.html
There are so many NDZs in New England that EPA made a 2009 map available here:
http://www.epa.gov/ne/eco/nodiscrg/index.html
Lectra/San is the earlier version of Electro scan. I believe Raritan is in the process of discontinuing Lectra/San.
http://www.epa.gov/owow/oceans/regulatory/vessel_sewage/vsdnozone.html
There are so many NDZs in New England that EPA made a 2009 map available here:
http://www.epa.gov/ne/eco/nodiscrg/index.html
Lectra/San is the earlier version of Electro scan. I believe Raritan is in the process of discontinuing Lectra/San.
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I agree with the above, just make sure it can’t be used and that it’s not used while in a NDZ
This is part of the EPA NY/NJ NDZ Google Earth file- it shows from the Peconic River east to the tip of Plum Island and Montauk is a NDZ
If you download the KMZ file it shows more detail-
Funny thing is that the GSB is not shown as an EPA NDZ
http://www.epa.gov/region02/gis/data/downloads/nodischargezones.zip
This is part of the EPA NY/NJ NDZ Google Earth file- it shows from the Peconic River east to the tip of Plum Island and Montauk is a NDZ
If you download the KMZ file it shows more detail-
Funny thing is that the GSB is not shown as an EPA NDZ
http://www.epa.gov/region02/gis/data/downloads/nodischargezones.zip
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Yes, your surveyor made a blanket statement that isn't quite correct. Yes, there are many No Discharge Zones in the Northeast; but the northeast isn't the whole country. The areas where treatment systems are permitted (and encouraged) vastly exceeds those where they aren't allowed. So treatment systems, themselves, are NOT illegal. However, their use is illegal in certain areas, among which are much (but not all) of New England and Long Island Sound.
The government, being the government, passed the marine sanitation laws to go into effect in 1978. Then, because they weren't ready, they postponed the implementation until 1980. The whole idea was to standardize rules and regulations so that they wouldn't vary from one area to another. Then they started changing things... Now it's just as confusing as it was before the laws ever went into effect. How's that for progress?
The government, being the government, passed the marine sanitation laws to go into effect in 1978. Then, because they weren't ready, they postponed the implementation until 1980. The whole idea was to standardize rules and regulations so that they wouldn't vary from one area to another. Then they started changing things... Now it's just as confusing as it was before the laws ever went into effect. How's that for progress?
Vic could comment further however I believe the PuraSan and a properly running LectraSan put out less pollutants than ground run off water from a rain storm. The EPA rules are actually a joke but they are strictly enforced in some areas. Once again a knee jerk government reaction with states petitioning for more and more areas out of ignorance to products that are superior to municipal waste treatment plants. What's funny is it's legal to jump in the water and do your stuff but not to throw a bucket of urine overboard, I would never do either but some do. Bill
If anyone tried to get the laws changed in order to be more modern, everyone
on this board would probably be dead before a decision would be made to allow
treatment systems to operate in all waters.
Look at all of the municipal treatment plants that dump millions of gallons of
untreated waste into our waters every year due to aging systems. Compare this
to the amount of recreational boats that have treatment systems and poop tanks.
There is a big difference in the amount of crap that goes into the waters from
cities than from recreational boats.
on this board would probably be dead before a decision would be made to allow
treatment systems to operate in all waters.
Look at all of the municipal treatment plants that dump millions of gallons of
untreated waste into our waters every year due to aging systems. Compare this
to the amount of recreational boats that have treatment systems and poop tanks.
There is a big difference in the amount of crap that goes into the waters from
cities than from recreational boats.
That's funny- in a black sort of way. So our boat waste is required to, um, ripen, in a holding tank, to be pumped into an aging, overburdened, and ineffective municipal sewage 'treatment' facility, to be discharged more-or-less untreated right back into the very water we're floating in.... OK....(sigh)...that's my government at work. And to think some people, some 52% of us at last count, think the gummint's got all the answers to live our benighted lives better and spend our money much more wisely than we poor stupid citizens can.
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Mimi, apropos to nothing, I was once friendly with a marina operator quite a few years back, who had a very unique pumpout system for the marina.
He had a hand truck with a 30 gallon steel drum strapped to it, and a Whale Gusher manual bilge pump mounted on top of it with all the appropriate hoses, valves and fittings necessary to pump out a boat's holding tank.
Then he hired a few college girls in bikinis for the summer. When someone called the marina office, requesting that their tank be pumped out, he'd send one of the bikinied beauties pushing the hand truck down the dock to the boat in question.
The girl would tell the owner, "Sir there's no charge for this service. When you've finished pumping out your tank, please call the marina office and someone will come out and retrieve the hand truck."
His logic was that no boater would be crass enough (all boaters being perfect gentlemen) to ask a young lovely thing to pump out his holding tank and thus, would do it himself. When he was done, he'd call the office and they'd send out a dock hand to wheel the now-heavy hand truck back to the office area, where he had a 1,000 gallon concrete septic tank buried in the ground. The contents of the steel drum were then pumped into the concrete tank, using the same Whale Gusher manual bilge pump
Coming out the bottom of the concrete tank was a 4" pipe with a gate valve where it exited the tank. The pipe then continued on to the middle of the river where the marina was located. The marina guy told me that, "Every so often, on a dark, foggy night, when no one's around, that valve sometimes gets accidently opened for a couple of hours. I've never actually had to call a honey dipper to come and empty the tank for me."
It was like that for several years that I know of, back in the early '80's - and for all I know (we've fallen out of touch) it may still be set up that way.
He had a hand truck with a 30 gallon steel drum strapped to it, and a Whale Gusher manual bilge pump mounted on top of it with all the appropriate hoses, valves and fittings necessary to pump out a boat's holding tank.
Then he hired a few college girls in bikinis for the summer. When someone called the marina office, requesting that their tank be pumped out, he'd send one of the bikinied beauties pushing the hand truck down the dock to the boat in question.
The girl would tell the owner, "Sir there's no charge for this service. When you've finished pumping out your tank, please call the marina office and someone will come out and retrieve the hand truck."
His logic was that no boater would be crass enough (all boaters being perfect gentlemen) to ask a young lovely thing to pump out his holding tank and thus, would do it himself. When he was done, he'd call the office and they'd send out a dock hand to wheel the now-heavy hand truck back to the office area, where he had a 1,000 gallon concrete septic tank buried in the ground. The contents of the steel drum were then pumped into the concrete tank, using the same Whale Gusher manual bilge pump
Coming out the bottom of the concrete tank was a 4" pipe with a gate valve where it exited the tank. The pipe then continued on to the middle of the river where the marina was located. The marina guy told me that, "Every so often, on a dark, foggy night, when no one's around, that valve sometimes gets accidently opened for a couple of hours. I've never actually had to call a honey dipper to come and empty the tank for me."
It was like that for several years that I know of, back in the early '80's - and for all I know (we've fallen out of touch) it may still be set up that way.
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Al, I suppose it was just fate. I was out of work back in the fall of 1971, 29 years old, with a new house, a wife, a two-year old, and a brand-new baby. My next door neighbor was Raritan's Plant Foreman at the time. He saw me out poking around in the yard for a number of days and, just making conversation one day, he asked me if I was on vacation. I said, "Yeah, permanent vacation. I'm out of work." He mentioned that Raritan was going to do some hiring for production workers, and that I might want to stop by and put in an application. He said, what the hey, it would at least be a temporary paycheck until I found something better.
The rest is history.
My formal training was in machine drafting and design, so I fit in, in a mechanical environment. After getting out of school, I'd worked for duPont, in Wilmington as an engineering technician intern, then Kontes Glass, a laboratory glassware manufacturer, as a draftsman. Then I spent 4 years in the now nonexistant U.S. Army Security Agency, and gained a Top Secret/Crypto clearance. I learned organization and learned to type (after a fashion) while in the service. Spent 2 1/2 years sitting on a mountain top in the Republic of Turkey, minding our country's affairs.
After getting out of the service, I managed two different bar and restaurants for a couple years, which qualifies me to be an unlicensed psychiatrist
. During the intervening years since signing on with Raritan, I've taken many, many courses in various different areas, but never actually got my degree. Three kids, and life, always seemed to get in the way.
At one point I was the sole technical writer in the company, writing all of the product manuals for quite a few years, as well as published articles in magazines, etc., on the topic of marine sanitation. I was the company draftsperson for a good while; I worked as an engineering technician for several years and was instrumental in getting Raritan's line of icemakers designed, built, and on the market in the early '90's; I did most of the design work on the Compact II and Crown Head II heads. I was the company's Hazmat guru for a while during the '80's, and have worn a whole variety of other "hats" within the organization. I've been in and out of Raritan's Customer Service Department several times. Finally, in 1996 (or 1997 - who remembers?) I decided to stay there for good. The pay has never been extraordinary, but I haven't missed a single paycheck since October, 1971. Few others can make that statement...
The rest is history.
My formal training was in machine drafting and design, so I fit in, in a mechanical environment. After getting out of school, I'd worked for duPont, in Wilmington as an engineering technician intern, then Kontes Glass, a laboratory glassware manufacturer, as a draftsman. Then I spent 4 years in the now nonexistant U.S. Army Security Agency, and gained a Top Secret/Crypto clearance. I learned organization and learned to type (after a fashion) while in the service. Spent 2 1/2 years sitting on a mountain top in the Republic of Turkey, minding our country's affairs.
After getting out of the service, I managed two different bar and restaurants for a couple years, which qualifies me to be an unlicensed psychiatrist
. During the intervening years since signing on with Raritan, I've taken many, many courses in various different areas, but never actually got my degree. Three kids, and life, always seemed to get in the way. At one point I was the sole technical writer in the company, writing all of the product manuals for quite a few years, as well as published articles in magazines, etc., on the topic of marine sanitation. I was the company draftsperson for a good while; I worked as an engineering technician for several years and was instrumental in getting Raritan's line of icemakers designed, built, and on the market in the early '90's; I did most of the design work on the Compact II and Crown Head II heads. I was the company's Hazmat guru for a while during the '80's, and have worn a whole variety of other "hats" within the organization. I've been in and out of Raritan's Customer Service Department several times. Finally, in 1996 (or 1997 - who remembers?) I decided to stay there for good. The pay has never been extraordinary, but I haven't missed a single paycheck since October, 1971. Few others can make that statement...
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Well, Vic, after reading your qualifications above, let me ask you a question...
I now very well see what you say about the waters around the Bahamas building up calcium. Is this the hard yellow stain I'm seeing in my bowl? I tried letting some RC soak for a while, but couldn't get it all off. Now I've got some CP soaking, and getting about the same results. Granted, at this point the system and my Electro Scan are running well, so it's just a matter of what color I want my bowl to be. But if there's something I can do to clean it before it gets worse, let me know.
I now very well see what you say about the waters around the Bahamas building up calcium. Is this the hard yellow stain I'm seeing in my bowl? I tried letting some RC soak for a while, but couldn't get it all off. Now I've got some CP soaking, and getting about the same results. Granted, at this point the system and my Electro Scan are running well, so it's just a matter of what color I want my bowl to be. But if there's something I can do to clean it before it gets worse, let me know.
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It might be, usually the buildup is an off-white, grayish, grainy deposit. If it's just a stain from discolored water, any mild scouring powder, such as Bon Ami can be used - just don't go crazy with it - no more than once a month - or you'll take the glaze off the ceramic bowl.
If it is indeed, a mineral buildup, it can be dissolved with a weak solution of muriatic acid (1 part commercial muriatic acid - 30-35% HCl - into 16 parts clean water) - same solution you use to clean the electrodes inside the Lectra/San. But don't leave it in the bowl too long - not more than an hour! Then flush it through, followed by plenty of clean water. It won't hurt the Lectra/San if you only do it occasonally.
If it is indeed, a mineral buildup, it can be dissolved with a weak solution of muriatic acid (1 part commercial muriatic acid - 30-35% HCl - into 16 parts clean water) - same solution you use to clean the electrodes inside the Lectra/San. But don't leave it in the bowl too long - not more than an hour! Then flush it through, followed by plenty of clean water. It won't hurt the Lectra/San if you only do it occasonally.
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This is pretty rust-colored Vic. I haven't seen this before. It's rather abrasive too as the brush somewhat hangs up on it. I'll just wait 'til I'm back. I'll do my annual electrode cleaning then anyway and just put some muriatic acid in the bowl for a little bit. However, are you saying a little Ajax, Bon Ami, or Commit won't hurt the ES? Or just Bon Ami as I guess that's not bleach-based?
Note: I know better than to do any of these on a regular basis. I use RC and/or CP 99% of the time with great results (Raritan should market the scents of each in magazines to sell more
Note: I know better than to do any of these on a regular basis. I use RC and/or CP 99% of the time with great results (Raritan should market the scents of each in magazines to sell more
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Yes Kurt, Bon-Ami or "ZUD" cleanser work well. Avoid anything with bleach in it, just the talc, pumice, and maybe a smidgeon of oxalic acid (contained in ZUD). Then flush the head with plenty of water, to dilute it as much as possible.