Croton ban on boating!!!!!!!

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rommer

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What is going on over at Croton? There are new signs on shore that seem to ban ALL water craft from coming closer than 750 feet of the shoreline as well as all swimming. I'm not just talking about the swimming area but the area with just woods.

I understand that someone died there a few weeks ago but you can't legislate against stupid behavior.

1000's of people have boated and anchored there over the years and we spend a fair number of weekends there each year. Our favorite spot is roughly 450' from shore at the drop line. (Measurement approximate based on radar)

We were there Friday night/Saturday morning but due to rough conditions left around 8AM before we had a chance to see if/how they are enforcing this new ban. Anybody know?

Who is enforcing this? Which entity created this unfair and absurd new rule?
 
Good question! I was hanging with a friend who is a "village official" last Monday and I asked him the same questions. I asked "how can they do that" and all he said was "it's the county, they can do what ever they want". So, it appears to be Westchester County and definitely not the Village of Croton.

What happened to people's rights to access the river? Is their a clause saying you must be on foot? Don't laws have to be passed? I wonder if anyone can cite the specific law that states 750'?

Currently, I definitely go in as close as possible when swimming with little ones (all the time). It is much SAFER than anchoring in 10' of water, mainly becuase all the adults and many kids can stand up if needed. So, IMHO, this does not address safety. WTF? What could it be?
 
I told you all this was coming. Politicians being afraid of being sued. One person made a poor judgement and ruins it for all.

We'll see what happens next but it looks like boating in the area will take another hit. I have a 2.5 yeah old and its hard to hold her to let her swim where I cant stand. Time to get out.
 
NYS Navigation Law, Section 46:

Section 46. Vessel regulation zone.

1.
(a) The board of supervisors or other legislative governing body of a county, or, should no action on the matter be taken by such board or body, the governing body of a city or incorporated village, by a three-quarters vote of its members, may establish a vessel regulation zone and within the limitations prescribed by this chapter, adopt regulations for the use of a lake or part of a lake or other body of water within the county, or in case of a city or incorporated village of the part of said waters adjacent thereto, if it shall deem that such establishment of a zone will promote the safety of the people and be for the best interests of the county, city or incorporated village.
(b) The governing body of a city or incorporated village, by a three-quarters vote of its members, may establish a personal watercraft and specialty prop-craft regulation zone and within the limitations prescribed by this chapter, adopt regulations for the use of a lake or part of a lake or other body of water adjacent to such city or incorporated village, if it shall deem that such establishment of a zone will promote the safety of the people and be for the best interests of the city or incorporated village. With respect to personal watercraft and specialty prop-craft, such regulations may include a prohibition of their use provided such prohibition does not prevent access to federally maintained and designated navigation channels.
2. Before any such zone shall be established, a public hearing shall be held before the members of the board of supervisors or other legislative governing body of the county or the governing body of the city or incorporated village, or a committee designated for that purpose, upon not less than thirty days notice of such hearing published in at least two newspapers having general circulation in the territory affected. Such notice will specify the time and place of hearing, the limits of the proposed zone which shall not exceed fifteen hundred feet from the shore line at low water mark of the body of water where the zone is to be established and the regulations proposed to be adopted. Following such hearing the committee shall report to the board of supervisors, or other legislative governing body of the county or the governing body of the city or incorporated village, and such board or governing body may adopt the limits of the proposed zone and its regulations. It shall be the duty of the clerk of the board of supervisors, or other legislative governing body of the county or the clerk of the governing body of the city or incorporated village to promptly file a certified copy of such established vessel regulation zone and regulations adopted in the office of the clerk of the county wherein such zone is established.
3. When such regulation zones are established there shall be constructed by the county, city or incorporated village establishing same, on the shore near each boundary, a signboard facing the water and bearing thereon in large letters "VESSEL REGULATION ZONE" with the rate of speed limited in that area and/or such other restrictions as may be adopted. Such signboard shall be conspicuously placed. Any expense incurred in the formation or operation of the zone or district shall be a county, city or incorporated village charge and shall be paid for in the same manner as other charges against such political units.

I doubt that they went through this entire process, I wonder how they plan to enforce it?
 
...and yet they continue to allow cars on the New York State Thruway, even though I heard someone died there once. Go figure.

Safe and Happy Boating!
ColonyCove
 
My very limited understanding as explained to me by a lawyer friend who admittedly did a quick search of NY state laws so this is worth exactly what you pay for it but the signs may not be legally binding in that they do not follow state law for proper wording. Something about having to state "boating control area" or something along those lines.

That said I certainly agree with Chris in the fact that the county seems to do what they want without regard to peoples wishes.

I just went to my navigation program and plotted a bunch of 750' bearing lines from the low water mark and the 750' ban renders 90% of the anchorage area BANNED!!!

Anybody have email addresses for the county officials? We need to start a campaign to keep our boating area intact!
 
Ahh, I see Hogan quoted the law while I was typing. I can assure you the current signs do not say "Vessel Regulation Area"

Looks like we might need a few test cases....
 
They should close the beach as well then too. But no - they can make money there. I dont see a difference between boating and swimming off the beach there.
 
BTW - I'm aware that Croton is not an "official" anchorage but just the same it has been used as such since there have been boats!
 
I called Croton Point Park at 914-862-5290 and left a message as there is little other option.

I then called Westchester Parks at 914-864-7000. The lady was very nice, put me on hold and called CPP directly. When she returned, she told me the reason was "due to liability". She then gave me the number above which I called to get the answering machine (see a pattern here?).

I called the Westchester Parks again and the lady was very nice, she put me on hold again and this time, after several minutes, "Alice" picked up. She was very nice and told me the Westchester Police reccommended the signage due to someone diving and breaking thier neck. I explained how it's much safer to be anchored closer where you can stand with young children. She asked how close that would be and I said probably 300-500 feet depending on the tide. She said when she had a boat, she never got that close but admittedly didn't have children. Alice also said that if you're in that close you probably won't get a ticket. We talked about how, in order to be safe, most boats do violate the rule and she said yes but they don't get tickets. One last question: what law are we violating if we are 750' close? The answer: I believe we own the land out to 750'

There ya have it guys....the Westchester Parks Commissioner is Joseph A Stout. I couldn't find an e-mail for him and I have to get back to work.
 
Mike posted the info as I was "on hold". According to Alice, the process was as simple as a recommendation from the County Police and not as cumbersome as Mike pointed out. That and considering the wording, I'm guessing the signs are bogus. Therefore, what should we do:

A) Work hard to get the signs removed and hope they do not go the official route.
B) Ignore the signs and hope nobody gets a ticket. If they do, fight it to resolve the matter once and for all. Heck, I'd even be willing to pass the hat to hire an attorney for this test case.

The advantage of option B is it might free-up some of the good spots for the locals. I'm favoring "Option B", considering, I doubt most of the signs will survive the winter.
 
quote:
Originally posted by WALSHIE

One last question: what law are we violating if we are 750' close? The answer: I believe we own the land out to 750'
Click to expand...


But they don't own the water!

750' out is roughly 65% of the existing area. Assumes an average distance of 1200 feet from MLW to the tip of Croton Park Point and since most boaters anchor inside the point lets say it's more like 84% (750/900) If they enforce this we can kiss Croton goodbye.

Not sure which of your suggestions I'm for Chris. I know that pushing them on this thing to remove the illegal signs is probably not the wisest move but on the other hand knowing they can just enforce things when ever they have a bad day bothers me.
 
Chris, perhaps you can find out whether this was done:

"It shall be the duty of the clerk of the board of supervisors, or other legislative governing body of the county or the clerk of the governing body of the city or incorporated village to promptly file a certified copy of such established vessel regulation zone and regulations adopted in the office of the clerk of the county wherein such zone is established."

There is no way they coplied with #2 of the law I posted above. This whole thing is sham and is unenforceable.
 
http://www.boatered.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=103835
 
how stupid can they be... some idiot dive head first into the bottom and they close an anchorage forcing parents and kids to swim in deep water ??

if they'd do that around here, 90% of the waters woudl be sealed off !
 
Actually, wasn't there grumblings about Westchester County not wanting boaters using Croton beach long before this. Seems like maybe they are using the diver death incident to re-visit the topic. Maybe using it as an excuse?
 
Judy

What do they think is wrong with boaters going to the beach? I can understand perhaps the marked swimming area but the wild area to the left as you face shore seems to be unimproved and not a bother to anybody. We dink in and the dog goes up into the woods to do his business. He runs around chasing a wave or 2 and then we head back out. This whole thing really seems bizarre to me. It's not like we block anyones view from a million dollar house or something...

If people were having campfires and littering the shoreline with bottles then perhaps I could see a point but that just doesn't happen there.
 
They cant make ANY money off of you by arriving by boat. They can charge to park you car or beach access.
 
Hogan

Can you look up Westchester county parks ordinance section 765.451?

Supposedly passed in 1979.
 
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